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Anonymous

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Steve Farrell  says:

Petition demands power restrictions for new drivers

A petition is calling for power restrictions for new car drivers in line with those faced by motorcyclists. The petition, posted on a government website, says drivers should face similar measures in the interests of equality and road safety. Riders are currently restricted to 33bhp for two years after passing the standard bike test. New rules from next year will limit...

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  • Posted 2 years ago (20 September 2012 17:23)

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DoomedDog

Joined:

Jul 10

Posts: 390

DoomedDog says:

+1 to what preunit said

and the old bullshit argument about 17 year olds being able to go out and drive a Veyron if they had the money so this is why we must bring in these restrictions is just that - bullshit.

The sooner the British electorate quits voting Conservative, Labour and the Liberal Democrats (you know, the parties responsible for imposing/allowing these laws) the better. There are plenty of choices out there at election time - whether it be other parties or someone standing as an independant.

It would've been better if those calling for these driver restrictions instead did more to prevent the ones imposed on motorcyclists. Pettion most definately NOT signed.

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Rogerborg

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Sep 09

Posts: 888

Rogerborg says:

Retarded petition is retarded

It's making a point all right: bikers are whiny pricks.

Our implementation of the 3DLD is insane and actually harmful to road safety because the very people who most need it, 16-18 year olds, won't get any training beyond the CBT.  But some pathetic moan to an increasingly impotent UK government is not the way to fix it.

Contact your MP, MEP and the DfT directly if you really care.

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Rotop

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Sep 12

Posts: 124

Rotop says:

Rogerborg

someone certainly is a whiney prick.

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matthewdaytona

Joined:

Feb 12

Posts: 17

Time for change

Im fed up of reading some of the articles below mentioning that 'if you dont want these laws then dont vote labour, lib dem, conservative' etc etc. Bullshit, thats got nothing to do with it.

I do not think the change in the motorcycle laws is actually a bad thing, its by no means perfect but its better than what it was. The laws are trying to make motorcycling safer for younger riders, im only 20 and to think i can jump on a hayabusa and go 200mph is just insane. However it is time that cars where bought up to the same level.

Teenagers in cars are often big headed and like to show off, i know, ive been there. Most teenagers crash their car within the first 6 months of passing, and most of these crashes are people showing off with mates who are also in the same car. does this not tell you anything?

Simple fix, to start with limit what they can actually drive, and if they want to drive sports/ high powered vehcials then they must complete further training in how to actually handle the power if they lose control

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Rogerborg

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Sep 09

Posts: 888

Rogerborg says:

Rotop: they started it

Also, I'm telling teacher.

matthewdaytona, the intent behind the 3DLD is OK, but the implementation is cack handed.

Because there's little point in doing the A1 test (as it won't get you on a bigger bike) so it'll actually put off the keen young riders who might otherwise have got training beyond the CBT from doing so.

They'll just get the fastest 125 that they can afford and wring its neck for 2 years.  Small, hard to see, sporting L plates that are a red rag to a bull, with mediocre brakes and suspension.  How is that going to help keep them safe?

At 19, everyone will do the new A2, bringing 2 years of bad habits with them.  Pass that and they'll be on 35kW bikes, significantly more than the 25kW restricted limit at the moment.

Except I expect that most of them will just say "Eff that, that's me paid for a DAS course, I'm not doing that again" and ride around unrestricted, two years earlier than the current 21+ DAS.

We'll see how it plays out, but if it does anything but produce a higher casualty and conviction rate among the fewer riders who bother getting into biking in the first place, I'll be amazed.

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Matz

Joined:

Sep 12

Posts: 1

Matz says:

(Subject:)? What else could the subject be?!

I don't think a tiered system for cars is the right direction.
Imagine for instance the effect it will have on the used market for the smallest cars. Driving and riding are as expensive as it is for people my age. Insurance costs alone are already stopping most people my age from driving anything above a 1.6 so why change it?

People will argue tha faster cars in the hands of the less experienced cause more deaths.
So why are the "bike" rule changes so opposed? Are they not dangerous too?
And yes many bikers, such as myself, are in fact opposed to "further" rule changes regarding tiers. But I've met a lot of bikers that think the whole idea of the original tiered system is nonsense and are going to see this petition as a way of getting back at their "apparent" enemy?

I wouldn't find it so bad if the reasons behind it were genuine, but it seems this is just a biker (who already has a driving licence) getting annoyed that his "chosen" mode of transport is taking more hits. I mean just read it! The accident rate is only mentioned at the very end, the majority of it is just about GETTING EVEN!

This is just my opinion, it's not necessarily right, but the vast majority of people trying to change things are neither new to bikes or cars.
Demanding equality!? This seems like it's just spite!

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Rotop

Joined:

Sep 12

Posts: 124

Rotop says:

restrictors

would be better for all car drivers under 21 55 mph limiter would give me a grin. Why aren't all cars limited to 70mph as standard?

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AdieR

Joined:

Apr 08

Posts: 3042

AdieR says:

DazLoczy

The point I were trying to put with the motorway test making one *fully* qualified is that whilst they may not need or use M-way skills, it'll allow insurers to argue that they're not "fully qualified" and therefore hike their premiums, on people who are often harder done by in terms of higher-than-average fuel prices and often with very little in the way of public transport; conversely those people with reasonable access to M-ways tend to have better options as regards public transport as M-ways tend to run between major towns / cities. I personally think that new drivers should be taught M-way driving as early as possible rather than restricted off them; the trouble is it would need to be universal to be fair, which then goes back to my original point about difficult M-way access.

I used to live in a remote part of Scotland, and the nearest motorway was a good 4 hours drive away. If you didn't drive or ride, you relied on public transport. Public transport amounted to a bus every 3 hours if you were lucky. It also meant you were at the mercy of bus operators actually running that route (some were stopped if they were deemed unprofitable, and sod anyone who happened to live or work on that route).

These days I'm in Yorks and an hour away from the A1(M), and I tend to get a decent mix of town / country / DC / M-way roads which is more than many people I can think of.

I will agree that the car test is too easy though - although i don't see any Gov't altering it much; it'd be too much of a vote loser, whereas bikers are a minority (ie "they don't matter too much").

As for the dangers of cars vs bikes, I think part of it is a perception problem; a car driver tends to assume they're safely cocooned in their big metal box, where a biker will mostly be far more aware of their vulnerability when things go pear shaped.

I do agree many M-way drivers require euthanasia though: as my dad put it to me when I started driving, "there's more people who don't know how to use motorways, than that do know".

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Vesuvio25

Joined:

Sep 12

Posts: 1

Vesuvio25 says:

A restriction would only be of any value if coupled with significantly increased Driver Training. There needs to be mandatory Advanced Driver Training, including motorway driving before the full licence can be awarded. This would do more for road safety than a restriction alone, considering the majority of new drivers will be driving a car that falls within any proposed power restriction anyway. A Vauxhall Corsa driven badly is still a potentially fatal hazard.

As far as Motorcycles are concerned; the under 19 125cc restriction is wise.

I could argue for a longer, more in depth CBT course to give learners a more solid foundation to build their experience onto, however, a learner must do just that, make mistakes, analyse and improve. There is only so much that can be done to smooth out that process.

For those aged 21 and over the time restriction upon passing their Standard Motorcycle Test is extreme, illogical and unnecessary. 2 years is a long time, and in no way guarantees that the individual will be any more prepared to ride a larger displacement bike when the restriction ends. 6-12 months with mandatory Advanced Rider Training on a bike with a minimum of 35kw power output would be a far superior route for rider safety and competence.

This 2 year restriction causes many individuals to prematurely remove their restriction kits on more powerful machines; effectively riding uninsured and with no licence, having no prior training on a larger bike, which is a danger to everyone. 6-12 months restricted with mandatory Advanced Rider Training would ultimately form better, safer motorcyclists.

The Advanced Rider Training after completing the test should also be applicable to those who have passed via Direct Access.

While restrictions can have some value, when logical, in the case of the under 19 125cc limit for example.

 

Ultimately: Increased Training > Increased Restrictions.

 

 

 

 

 

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Bob_1

Joined:

Feb 05

Posts: 223

Bob_1 says:

Why Not ?

Why not have a graduated path from the driving test to a licence for higher powered vehicles! We have relied on the insurance premiums to limit what young or new drivers can drive. Making it official isn't neccessarily a bad thing as long as there is a path to a full licence through further testing. I saw in the news that when Chevrolet became a sponsor for Man United and offered free cars a lot of the players wanted Corvettes. Sir Alex blocked the younger players from having one. Now why on earth do you think that was.

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