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Anonymous

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MCN  says:

You ask/you answer: Should I take advanced training?

I passed Direct Access two years ago, and haven't taken any further training since. People keep telling me that pre-test training only teaches you to pass the test, and that I should do ROSPA, IAM, Bikesafe – or anything that'll teach me some advanced riding techniques. Are they right, or is simple experience and riding more miles, more valuable? Your answer could help....

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  • Posted 2 years ago (25 September 2012 17:56)

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jimbo8098

Joined:

Nov 11

Posts: 203

jimbo8098 says:

Advanced Training

I'm doing my enhanced rider training soon. It costs me £130  for it. Rospa and IAM are membership based where you can pay the £130 odd membership for 1 year and do your test that year and thats it , you can cancel the membership but keep the qualification. I was speaking to a guy doing IAM tests and he says they go out on reegular ride outs together and they end up critisising each other every time to get them all riding better but he says the way they ride is like a big snake , all in a line , very fast , all the right lines , etc.

So you basically pay for the initial testing then also for the ride outs. They tend to give out "freebies" like ride magazine or something.

If what my mate says is true , its well worth the money!

 

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Hedgehog5

Joined:

Aug 02

Posts: 2319

Hedgehog5 says:

Exportmanuk...

... fair enough, it was just the impression that the obvious omission gave me. Perhaps, as a member (if you are a member), you should ask that the articles are opened up to comment to counter this impression & encourage discussion.

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exportmanuk

Joined:

Feb 11

Posts: 13

exportmanuk says:

Hedgehog5

Hi Yes I am a member have been for a number of years now an observer. I do this because it keeps my skills high. Think about this... Do the WSB riders F1 drivers and professional footballers take regular training? Yes of course they do. Would they do it if there was no benefit? I mean it stops them spending money on WAGS so I guess there must be something to gain from training and if its good enough for them why not you. And as someone has commented the group I belong too and many other to have regular rides and social meets

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muddybus

Joined:

Aug 10

Posts: 66

muddybus says:

start with improving the basics

I know some people who have gone for advanced tuition too soon. I think you need to be reasonably confident with your riding before having advanced tuition because of the way they teach you to ride. They teach you to ride each corner wide, giving you maximum visiblity, which is great for an experienced rider, but i've known a couple of newbies get into trouble by riding wide, and when things aren't going right, ending up with one drifting into the kerb, and the other hitting an oncoming car. In both cases, an experienced rider would of leant the bike more, or trail-braked, whereas both novice riders grabbed a handful of front brake, the bike stood up and both crashed. You need to have the basics sorted first, then advanced riding with simply make you smoother and safer. Advanced riding will not help a nervous biker.

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muddybus

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Aug 10

Posts: 66

muddybus says:

ExportmanUK

WSB and F1 riders/drivers dont take regular training, they practice over and over again. Lets face it, who can train them when they are the elite at what they do? They know how to drive on the limit, they just need to perfect it. Those scenarios are completely different to road rider training. Tommy Hill rides his bike on the track differently to John McGuinness on the road. Neither will ride like a bike cop, or even like your local weekend-warrior. Riders need to be confident with their bikes, then advanced riding will make them more observant and safer. I think novice riders should be encouraged to take more of a 'racing line' on corners, so if they get the speed or apex wrong, they have a few feet of tarmac with which to drift and correct their speed to avoid a crash. Sending a novice rider on a wide, advanced riding line is dangerous. See my other post for more info.

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Hedgehog5

Joined:

Aug 02

Posts: 2319

Hedgehog5 says:

Export...

You've totally ignored my last post to make a your point... in my 1st post I said "Maybe I will" join a group but that the impression I get is that I won't be listened to... a point you have just reinforced.

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shorty42

Joined:

Sep 12

Posts: 7

shorty42 says:

Advanced For All !!

I Have Done Both Bikesafe & IAM Training & learned a lot from both, I Had a Gixxer & i used to do regular track days also. what is not understood is that the main thing that is learned from advanced training is OBSERVATION, i became much more aware of my surroundings, quite often can tell what is coming 3 bends away. Advanced training is NOT for stereotypical sit up & beg riders, it's for EVERYONE, we can all learn from it & it really does make you a much safer rider. if you only learn 1 lifesaving thing from it, it was worth 10 times what you pay!!!

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Motorsportsfan

Joined:

Oct 08

Posts: 12

@Homer40

The problem with your "Arse time in the seat will give you that, nothing else" approach is that if you are doing something wrong clocking up the miles will make that a heavily ingrained bad habit and very hard to shift. Humans are notoriously bad at self assessment, having lots of experience never does anything to improve this it only make people more certain that their self view is correct. Having said all that, you are correct that there is nothing better than putting in the miles when it comes to learning new skills, the challenge is to be open minded enough to know that none of us know everything and we can always improve.

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Motorsportsfan

Joined:

Oct 08

Posts: 12

@Hedgehog5

I'll start with expressing a vested interest, I've been an Observer for the IAM for more than 20 years (both cars and bikes), I am currently a Senior Observer with the same IAM Group as ExportmanUK (but we have not discussed this, I just happened across it). IAM Groups are not "The IAM", we are merely affiliated to it so we do not know, nor have influence over, what they put out in the media. I will however hazard a guess. You only have to look at the comments on this topic to see it ranges from the down right idiotic, through the misinformed, to the knowledgeable. Just like the Theory of Evolution, some people think that the advice on advanced riding is a matter opinion when both are in fact based on massive amounts of research and evidence. So opening the advice up for comment serves only those who are delusional enough to think they know better. This is only my guess at why comments were not permitted, I do not have any inside knowledge (or necessarily agree with it).

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Motorsportsfan

Joined:

Oct 08

Posts: 12

@Rogerborg

Please don't judge a whole group from your experience with one Observer and don't judge all groups by your experience of one group. People and groups are different. QUOTE "If they're just giving it large about "The System" while caning it over blind hill crests ('cause they are Advanced and therefore have x-ray eyes)". The problem with this advice is that an experienced advanced rider will see far more than an average rider. Even though I've been an Observer for more than 20 years I am always humbled when I ride with our regional examiner because his observational and machine control skills are so much better than mine. I therefore would be foolish to try to judge how safely he is riding based on my abilities. What I would advise is don't try to emulate these guys or you will get yourself in trouble. Also while reading the books is sensible, it can not replace having someone look at your riding.

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