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Anonymous

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Matthew Birt  says:

2012 MOTOGP MOMENTS – DUCATI DISASTER

It’s the Valencia MotoGP test in November, 2010 and the wave of optimism sweeping through Ducati’s factory garage is so powerful it could almost knock you off your feet. Valentino Rossi has arrived to prove the bike was no one-hit wonder in the hands of Casey Stoner and help restore Ducati as a potent threat to the Japanese domination of MotoGP. Two...

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  • Posted 2 years ago (20 December 2012 14:38)

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Bultoboy

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Apr 11

Posts: 3391

Bultoboy says:

CCB

Why hire one of two best riders in the world,(both stoner and Rossi) then ignore their feed back. Philippe made his own sword, and then fell on it

How can you say this with any conviction...???

Are you seriously saying they didn't listen to anything Rossi said and gave him nothing - Are you saying Preziosi FORCED the aluminium perimeter frame on him and that he never wanted it.

Was it some dream I had in which Rossi and Burgess asked for an aluminium perimeter frame...

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Bultoboy

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Apr 11

Posts: 3391

Bultoboy says:

YZRM1

Ducati began 2011 with the GP11 CF bike  FRAME 1

At Assen (I think) Rossi had the new GP12 chassis because he asked for it.  FRAME 2

At Aragon, he had a new version of the CF frame made in aluminium because he asked for it  FRAME 3

In Jerez testing in Spetember he tried a new aluminium perimeter frame because he asked for it  FRAME 4

In winter testing he had a new version of the aluminium frame tested in Jerez based on his feedback  FRAME 5

By Qatar 2012 he had another version of the frame tested in winter testing because he asked for it   FRAME 6

By Mugello 2012 he had another new frame to try   FRAME 7

There were numerous swingarm designs

I make that more than 2 frame and swingarm designs, plus he also had a new engine casting to accomodate the swingarm arrangement they wanted

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wosihound

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Jul 12

Posts: 3146

wosihound says:

Absolute Tosh from Bulto.

Complete and utter bollocks. Can't say I'm surprised though..

Here's what Jerry Burgess had to say..and he should know.


“This bike is still a frame wrapped around an engine, rather than an engine designed to go in a frame. We need new crankcases because we can’t keep raising the engine because then the countershaft sprocket gets higher and higher which affects the swingarm pivot and thus handling. You’d think we would’ve had new ’cases by Le Mans, but here we are at the ninth race with the same bike we had at the first tests.
 
“We had to fit a frame around an engine that is already designed and it will take years or a long time to find the best solution. Ducati doesn’t have the same experience as the Japanese manufacturers.

 ‘If you don’t do anything, you don’t get anything, Nothing happened! Compared to what a Japanese manufacturer would have done there are significant differences, as you can see by counting the number of frames Honda builds in a single season.”

 “Continuing to work in the way they work, we would be left behind for another ten years. We’ve the same chassis as the first race of the year and a frame does more than keep the wheels separate, it must work. If a Japanese company had the same results of Rossi and Hayden, it would be building a new frame in a week. The fact that the Ducati has lost Valentino is a strong message that something needs to change.”

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Bultoboy

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Apr 11

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Bultoboy says:

Different context Wosi

That's saying they didn't do enough quickly enough - that wasn't the issue.

You and one or two others said they didn't listen, gave him nothing, spent nothing - not so.

Interesting also that Burgess latterly thinks of the engine as a problem - there are enough quotes from him throughout 2011 and early 2012 saying categorically that the engine wasn't the problem.

And this quote:

"We’ve the same chassis as the first race of the year"

was prior to this year's new frame.

Do you dispute my frame count then Wosi?

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princeofrepsol

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Mar 11

Posts: 474

Victim of a Workplace Psychopath....

Poor Pippo, scape goat for MotoGp's premier Industrial Psychopath, thank god Rossi is going back to yamaha where his management and team mate have seen it all before and will ensure they have the necessary structures in place to be able to deal with team yellows toxic presence. I bet Vale shat himself when Lin showed him his KPI's.

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moto4

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Oct 12

Posts: 144

moto4 says:

I dont know but...

... it seems unlikely to be the 'fault' of just one man (Preziosi). Maybe he too was pushing for new things to test but Ducati as a company is not geared to manufacturing, say, five frames all marginally differing in order to grasp the minutae. Perhaps the company struggles with continuous development- I'm sure I've read Casey, Vale and Burgess claim as much in recent years. At times I read Rossi purporting to be happy with development & Casey's displeasure at the sheer amount of new 'stuff'. Without decent results he now seems to claim there was none.

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moto4

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Oct 12

Posts: 144

moto4 says:

future development

I hope Ducati return to a monocoque design simply because it is different and forward thinking. Preziosi leaving suggests not and I fear Audi's influence will lead to follow the leader copying rather than innovation. Ducati alone could not hope to compete by emulating the Japanese but with Audi backing they probably could, with time. MotoGP will be poorer for it though. Whether trellis, carbon monocoque or 'funny' front ends, variety of designs is more interesting than clones.

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YamahaGYTR

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Sep 11

Posts: 2289

YamahaGYTR says:

Like to see who Audi brings in as Preziosi's replacement.

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eddl

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Dec 10

Posts: 474

eddl says:

moto4

with the money now involved and the prestige of being a winning bike it's hard for any manufacturer to go out on a limb with a different frame design, you gotta be competitive first and foremost.

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MandyRamola

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Sep 12

Posts: 192

MandyRamola says:

Bernhard Gobmeier

According to the article Elbowz...

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