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Anonymous

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Matthew Birt  says:

Ducati confident in old bike strategy

Ducati is confident its surprise strategy to kick off preparations for 2013 using an old version of its factory Desmosedici machine is the right approach to help it threaten Honda and Yamaha’s domination of MotoGP in the future. Although the bike unveiled by Nicky Hayden and Andrea Dovizioso in the Madonna di Campiglio ski resort is badged a GP13, it is...

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  • Posted 2 years ago (16 January 2013 13:43)

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Nostrodamus

Joined:

Mar 09

Posts: 5391

Nostrodamus says:

Jeez there's some deluded souls in MCN land

or perhaps they're in the main simply thick. Well actually truth be told they're both.

MotoGP is an inherently conservative game. Revolution rarely happens. The last time we saw that was the bold introduction of the CF chassis on the D16. A concept still far from fully explored. Anyway Rossi tantied this chassis away to be replaced by the ubiquitous aluminium beam frame for better or for worse. I for one hope the C-F gets a parallel development either this year or next. This is a real area of potential benefit for Audi also.

So Gobmeier states there is much they still need to explore with the current chassis configuration. That's not to say that Corse are running pure 2012 machines. The 2013 models will have incorporated small modifications (mainly electronic as it sounds). Corse starting with semi-known material is quite normal. It's not like Rossi pushed the performance envelope with it last year to give truly meaningful feedback. Two seconds slower than cripple Stoner at Philip Island, running CRT times is a disgrace. The D16 is far better than that.

If you listen to some of the fools on here you'd think YMC & HRC churn new parts and chassis' constantly. Utter nonsense. Yes O.K HRC is at times the exception, as for example they brought Dani something like five chassis' and three swingarms at the start of 2010 to test. But in 2011 he mainly ran his end of 2010 chassis. 2012 HRC had the same number of chassis' as Ducati - three, and still didn't fully solve their chatter issue. Their riders adapted. That's what class does.

The M1. That thing is barely changed since the day Furusawa first rolled it out 2004. Rossi spent six months bleating about chatter in 2006. No magic, no endless supply of chassis' as professed on here to fix the problem. Or another example; Rainey reverting to the ROC chassis way back as he was disgruntled with the factory frame. The M1 has had measured incremental improvement during its lifetime. Look how it's taken them almost two years to develop a seamless gearbox in the manner of HRC. Ducati responded to this technical jump much quicker. So please, really, don't give me that 'the Japs jump and voila instant improvement' BS. Overnight magic is fairytale land for Oompa Loompa's.

I'm with Gobmeier. There's untapped speed and potential in the D16 as it is. Once understood then the Audi engineering muscle can come to the party.

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Ivebeenthehero

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Jun 09

Posts: 851

Bit offensive ;-)

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smilo996

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Posts: 109

smilo996 says:

i would bet that Rossi's No1 goal next year is to get into Lorenzo's head and blender his brain. That should suit Dani nicely and as long as Merguez does not dominate then I reckon it will be Dani, Lorenzo, Merguez, Rossi. It all seems to have gone especially wrong with Ducati in 08. They went from steel trellis in 07 to carbon in 08. At least the steel trellis gave good feedback and by adding different types of scaffolding you could adjust the set up. They also have to address the V angle. But they can't until Audi say so. I would reckon no one understood the carbon chassis feedback because it is carbon and because it is so short. Aluminium would help but as Burgess pointed out, the chassis is so short the feedback is still minimal. That would explain Stoner's results slump in 08 and beyond. It was however he who asked for that chassis. Until Audi stump up the cash then Ducati will not be able to change the engine angle. And I think Audi have decided to draw a line under Rossi & Burgess. Keep the GP12 as a base setting and then go from there. If they came up with a new design for this year they have no real idea whether it would be better or worse. I still maintain and this goes to the heart of the lack of innovation in motogp, that Burgess has no experience of anything other than beam frames and recently 4's So their input was largely wide of the mark. The Britten was innovative but look at the motogp bikes. They all use the same forks and brakes, same tyres, only Ducati have a different frame type, plus Inline 4's & V4's. There is no doubt that Audi will not let the Ducati do other than win, that is the German way. Look at the 911. Take a fundamentally flawed design and make it work. Remember Audi's of 25 years ago, they were crap. Now they are often better than Merc & BMW. I think they will start by getting lots of feedback and data then make changes more rapidly and Ducati will no longer be forced to make a bike like their road bikes, so the design solutions will expand. As they have already stated this year it is expected that they will not make any results. Must be annoying for Hayden though. They have 4 riders of differing styles, backgrounds and ages. So this will provide the best possible feedback to make a bike that will suit different riders. But zee Germans will win in the end, they always do (apart from when they are lead by a complete nutter).

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Bultoboy

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Apr 11

Posts: 3456

Bultoboy says:

They went from steel trellis in 07 to carbon in 08.

Are you sure?

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cornbowl

Joined:

May 12

Posts: 994

cornbowl says:

Either way

Ducati loose, as it stands, it's a warmed over turd. If they fixed the bike Ducati still ain't gonna win anything, because they are not employing a rider capable of winning MotoGP title.

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PaceyCasey

Joined:

Jun 11

Posts: 2564

PaceyCasey says:

smilo

''i would bet that Rossi's No1 goal next year is to get into Lorenzo's head and blender his brain.''

-----------------------------------------------------------

He already has, along with Dani. JLo's shown his weakness in the past and had a long, long winter thinking about a tough year ahead. He'll do what he usually does, ride for points imo.  

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saturn392

Joined:

Nov 03

Posts: 2232

saturn392 says:

Championships are won or lost  by knowing when to push and when to settle. Works riders are employed to win championships for their employers - that's whey theyr'e paid the mega-bucks.  Honda Yamaha Ducati etc.. use  MotoGP to promote their products - that's also why the manufacturers championship is most important to them, the riders championship is secondary in their eyes.    Nostro and Bulto and a few others will disagree but that's the bottom line.  

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weskit

Joined:

Jun 10

Posts: 510

weskit says:

rossi in lorenzo's head?

Not a chance. Remember last year when the master of mind games came up with "young motogp riders are pussies", only to have it swatted away with "It must be a shame to be beaten by pussies. Every week". The mind games are a myth I'm afraid, much like the development skills.

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saturn392

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Nov 03

Posts: 2232

saturn392 says:

Oh Wow

Waistcoat ... '' sticks and stones'' eh !

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YamahaGYTR

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Sep 11

Posts: 2289

YamahaGYTR says:

I'll second that weskit that prima donna was made to look like a pussy for two years.

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