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Anonymous

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MCN  says:

Rossi: 'Ducati can't deal with criticism'

Valentino Rossi has revealed more about his fractious relationship with Ducati in MCN's exclusive new interview (out on Wednesday). The 34-year-old's comments throw new light on the team's inability to make progress back up the grid – a problem he says stems from their inability to trust its riders when they point out a problem with the bike. He says in the...

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  • Posted 2 years ago (15 March 2013 14:37)

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doohanfan

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Jan 12

Posts: 1167

doohanfan says:

thanks wosi

and pogo. I don't think anyone has ever previously realised that it is not a good idea to have crashes or dnfs if you want to win a world championship.

I have had a similarly radical original thought. Why not just give credit to everyone who wins a world championship, which almost invariably involves multiple factors including not crashing and being on a competitive bike which doesn't have too many mechanical dnfs?.

To put my point made in previous posts more bluntly, leaving the riders aside, of the last 30 championships, 15 have been won by honda riders, 12 by yamaha riders, 2 by suzuki riders, and 1 by a ducati rider. If ducati and suzuki manage to occasionally jag having a bike which is semi-competitive, it hardly behoves fans of riders who have won on hondas or yamahas to complain.`

I don't think anyone rates freddie spencer with king kenny or steady eddie overall, but apparently he rode in an absolutely sublime fashion for  2 years and beat krsr and lawson for championship wins, with no belittling of those championships by anyone that I can recall. Wayne gardner was in no way comparable over his career with eddie lawson, but no-one complained about or belittled his single championship on an obviously fast but brutal bike which tried to kill him for most of the season, or told his fans (which included me at the time) that they shouldn't enjoy his championship because it was worthless and meaningless in view of lawson having won more championships than him. Of course lawson went on to master that brutal honda as well, from which I could draw further parallels if you like.  

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Nostrodamus

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Nostrodamus says:

That's it DF

Truly great riders can win despite their machines. Lawson and Stoner spring to mind.

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doohanfan

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doohanfan says:

not precisly my point nostrodamus

but I would have thought schwantz and krjr (and acknowledging my fanboyism stoner as well) deserve more rather than less credit for winning on bikes other than hondas and yamahas.

No doubt lawson is right up there in the pantheon though.

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Bultoboy

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Apr 11

Posts: 3024

Bultoboy says:

Yeah Yeah Wosi

We all know most points wins the championship.

Your quote was Biaggi ran Doohan extrmemly close and the point of it was to show what a great rider Biagga was due to the prior references to Rossi having not much competition in his early years.

Whatever the points table suggests the truth is that Biaggi didn't do anything like run Doohan close in terms of matching him. If Doohan had suffered another two failures and Biaggi had finished one place better in one of the races where he was back in 5th or 6th, he'd have won the title.

So what does that mean? That he's a better rider than Doohan and took his title by matching and beating him? Or does it mean that by circumstance and ill fortune to another rider he just accumulated more points to be crowned world champ over a rider that was faster and whom he never beat in a single race.

In such an event, I know which of those two would have felt better about their own performance that year.

And unlke 2006, Doohan didn't mentally unhinge and throw it away at the last race where he only needed a couple of points.

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doohanfan

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doohanfan says:

whoever wins

wins in my view, with the possible exception of capirossi's 250 championship after the last race incident I have never seen.

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wosihound

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wosihound says:

Look Bulto..you charmless Nerk

I'm not interested in how you see things, with a bunch of if's but's & maybe's..we all know your negative bias against Rossi.

Them's the facts Pal and that IS a lot closer than you've been saying about Stoner last year, while making excuses and ignoring what happened.

You've been shot down in flames and haven't got the good grace and admit it..which is just fine, because it just confirms what a dolt you are. Zero credibility as a rounded commentator and not particularly bright either.

It's been a favourite line amongst you Orange gumbies that Biaggi and others weren't in Stoner, Lorenzo & Pedrosa's class to lessen Rossi's championships.

It's pure fanboy speculation to support a bias point of view. At least he rode bikes when they were proper bikes..not wiping riders' arses with all these poncy electronic aids.

Wosi speculates he' have had your 3 aliens crying in WSB based on their previous girly form..ganging up and whining about Simoncelli's tough riding. 

WTF has Pedrosa done in 7 years working for the biggest & most powerful manufacturer in the world? Wosi speculates he would have broken himself in two and retired very early in that era.

Where did Stoner finish in his debut season?..and WTF had he won before 2007?..and if, like your bumchum Nostro says, his championship winning bikes were so dire..how come he won over half his races in those Two seasons, out of the Seven he rode..and FAILED to back respective titles up..last year getting beaten by his team mate, who as stated above, has won exactly fuck all.

Hardly stuff of legends is it, you sad monkey?

 

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saturn392

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Nov 03

Posts: 1659

saturn392 says:

What it boils down to is this,   going back to Doohanfans post on Gardner's and Schwantz's championships which were hailed as great victories in the face of adversity and Nostro saying great riders can win despite their machines.  No doubt this is the case and Gardner and Schwantz were hailed as hero's because they were popular guys as well as racing masters.   The problem most people have with Stoner (if they're honest) in not his astonishing speed or riding ability - it is due to his personality which came across as moaning, whining, arrogant and brattish, quite simply he did not endear himself to the majority of fans.    Any other rider taking the Ducati to victory against the might of the Japanese Giants in 2007 would have been hailed the hero as was David when he defeated Goliath.

I've said it before Casey was his own worst enemy - his personality destroyed his credibility as a champion.

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doohanfan

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doohanfan says:

saturn

I have no problem with people not liking stoner. I do have a problem with people inventing reasons why he didn't really win the 2 championships he did win.

I doubt lawson or spencer would have prospered in the public consciousness if they had won championships against rossi either, lawson was dour, and fast freddie fairly charmless off track.

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doohanfan

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doohanfan says:

here we go again wosi

How young did you want stoner to succeed? Is being the second youngest premier class champion of all time by a matter of months from freddie spencer insufficient? Do they take the olympic gold medal for the 100 metres freestyle away from the winner because the runner up beat him in backstroke in the under 15s?

I have already pointed out the ludicrous nature of your argument concerning the subtraction of  stoner's 2 great seasons, but if you want to take it further in the same seven years both he and stoner were in motogp, rossi won 15 rather than 20 races in his 2 championship seasons, and 11 rather than 18 races in his non-championship seasons.

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DogBert

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Jan 13

Posts: 204

DogBert says:

Curious

Truly great riders can win despite their machines.

Casey won the 2007 title not because of his bike, but despite it? Does anyone who witnessed the 2007 season really believe that?

What about riders who don't win despite having truly great machines? Casey and Dani last year for example.

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