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Anonymous

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Matthew Birt  says:

Valentino Rossi: ‘I need to be faster for the podium’

Valentino Rossi might have been happy to have finished fifth quickest in today’s opening MotoGP practice at Phillip Island, but the Italian admits he needs to improve his pace to claim a 14th podium finish in Australia. The Italian set a best time of 1.29.537 to finish just over 0.5s behind factory Yamaha teammate Jorge Lorenzo, as the MotoGP field took...

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  • Posted 315 days ago (18 October 2013 09:37)

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Bultoboy

Joined:

Apr 11

Posts: 3335

Bultoboy says:

Really ?

To me, it's telling that JL appears to highlight the same problems Rossi says the bike has..almost parrot fashioned. He's never said anything other than "we need more power" before this year.

So last year, we never heard Lorenzo complaining about needing to improve:

Edge grip

Grip and stability into corners

Drive out of corners

And the old favourite - acceleration

Last year, we never heard Rossi say I don't know how to fix this bike I'm not an engineer?

And I'd like someone to explain why Lorenzo complains about not being able to brake as hard and late as the Hondas when all the TV pundits and experts on here cite early braking and higher corner entry speed as Lorenzo's style. In that case, how can he brake as late as MM or Pedrosa? If they are braking harder and later than him it's more likely to be the way they ride. If a rider is getting beaten he'll look for excuses.

And Wosi - Where is the Yamaha statement about Rossi coming back to correct Lorenzo's poor development direction. I seem to remember the Yamaha race team staement as being they didn't want him back, it was a marketing decision, not a racing one.

Rossi has illustrated Ducati and their bike were responsible for the barren two years, not him.

Never really any argument about that though. The flak started because of his attitude towards Stoner and how he wasn't putting the effort in and trying hard enough and how he and Burgess would soon have it sorted. The first couple of laps on the bike provided the first of many servings of humble pie when he realised how difficult to ride it really was. It also blew the myth of how adaptable he was, as is evident this year.

Give him a bike he's comfortable with and he's as fast as most, there's no issue with that and there is nothing wrong with a rider being more comfortable on a bike that suits their style. Not every rider can ride anything. But what some people don't seem to like is that the hype from his earlier years where he was touted as being able to do surmount any difficulty has been exposed as just that - hype.

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wosihound

Joined:

Jul 12

Posts: 3025

wosihound says:

weally, twuly..

I can't recall JL complaining about the first two points on your list last year Bulto?

The second two points are the same thing and have always been Lorenzo's stock in trade..until this year.

Also, it may surprise you but Rossi isn't an engineer, he's a rider. He does possess an idea of what works for him though and communicates that clearly, which generally improves a bike making it easier to ride for others too, as has been proved in the past.

Some corners are not high speed, they're hairpins. Most overtaking is done into such corners on the brakes. This is what Rossi and Lorenzo, the parrot, are talking about.

You can't be so dull as to expect an official statement from Jarvis slagging Lorenzo's development skill, surely?

His own crew chief, Forcada, says he's weak technically. It's rumoured Honda didn't sign Jorge earlier in his career because they were unconvinced with his capacity to develop. Yamaha were concerned. Rossi led them from the wilderness 2004. They know he's good in this area.

If it was all about money/marketing, where are the big buck new sponsors like FIAT and PETRONAS?

We know it still irks you that Rossi took the pish out of Stoner like fans did too.

As for Rossi just being as fast as most, but only on a bike he's comfortable with?

That's the general idea..it means consistency. You don't crash and burn your championship aspirations by overriding to make up for the motorcycle's faults.  

He's the most winning top class rider of all time. 9 titles, winning on 7 different bikes in 5 different classes. Is that a myth too?

If he wins again before season's end..will you do a disappearing act like you did after Qatar and Assen?

[This Reply has been modified by the Author]

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CH987

Joined:

May 09

Posts: 877

CH987 says:

"You don't crash and burn your championship aspirations by overriding to make up for the motorcycle's faults"

 "maybe the Hondas can have some problem and if I can stay close to Jorge it means I can be on the podium"

What Championship aspirations?

Rossi still 0.748s slower than Lorenzo. But at least he beat Stoners 2008 lap record, by 0.018s. But hang on a minute

"The grip is better, but especially there are a lot less bumps and in this weather it is fantastic to ride in Phillip Island. It is worth a minimum of one second"

Giacomo Agostini 15,  Ángel Nieto 13, Valentino Rossi 9,Mike Hailwood 9,Carlo Ubbiali 9. So joint third then or is that a myth too?

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wosihound

Joined:

Jul 12

Posts: 3025

wosihound says:

The crash & burn comment..

..was directed at HRC riders past and present.

To be fair, I don't believe anyone thought Val was in with a sniff this year. Certainly not the bookies who had Pedrosa slight odds-on favourite from Jorge.

Serial detractors such as your good self and Bulto were apoplectic he got the Yamaha ride and reckoned Rossi would be nowhere. Wins? Multiple podium? you scoffed..Dovi was going to show us that all Ducati needed was a decent rider, remember?

Remind me not to ask you for my lottery numbers, Einstein.

You're bitter and desperate..as illustrated by the childish bitchiness in your tone.

No no no..Rossi's not a legend or winningest rider of all time, look..he's joint 3rd on the list?

Hahaha...nob. 

 

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CH987

Joined:

May 09

Posts: 877

CH987 says:

Serial detractors such as your good self and Bulto were apoplectic he got the Yamaha ride and reckoned Rossi would be nowhere. Wins? Multiple podium? you scoffed..Dovi was going to show us that all Ducati needed was a decent rider, remember?

Nope, I hoped he would be at the front fighting for wins. And I don't rate Dovi the HRC,Yamaha reject at all. But well done. You did manage a whole post without using the S word.

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DeGrasse

Joined:

Aug 13

Posts: 2707

DeGrasse says:

CH987 and other Rossi detractors.

 You're simplifying to the extreme, simpler than to inform yourself and figure that this chassis was designed for Lorenzo with a longer swing arm and is more suited to fast curves, a look at the partials would tell more than long speeches.

Rossi can't even slide it on the brakes as he used to do with the 2010 bike, thing that Pedrosa and Marquez does with ease on the Honda, do you see Lorenzo do it? No, this W-E he tried to push on the gas and had to stop immediately for a change of pants, he was lucky because in assen and Sachenring he crashed, as i said if you want to comprehend the reason why, use a sledgehammer to pin a nail while holding it by its end, then come back and tell us you can't tell the difference between wheelbase length.

Rossi main issue is certainly not his age, with bike settings to the stop, he can't ride it at 100% and it is more appearent when the track suits Jorge, reason why he is further away from him than in Sepand where he outqualified him and signed better race times.

He still won a GP, qualified in the front row and finished with a few podiums despite this and there aren't many pilots who could manage this and stay on top of the bike all season, but of course you took a stance as did some other folks all over www and wont have the honnesty to say, sorry i was wrong. Man, like we care.

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DeGrasse

Joined:

Aug 13

Posts: 2707

DeGrasse says:

@Bultoboys

 About these points (Edge grip, Grip and stability into corners, Drive out of corners, acceleration): I didn't read Lorenzo complaining about stability into corners yet, his bike is probably the most stable out there. But the others points yes, especially since rossi spoke about them at the start of the season.

Not in 2012, because he didn't need to push that hard, also his style is hidding the issues, it looks comfortable but he never is at the limit, when he is, the bike bites him hard, he doesn't slide the bike, is one of the top 6 guys who brakes the earliest and only moderately and uses longer trajectories, making him harder to pass on the brakes.

His setting are extreme for long wheelbase and Crutchlow commented that no one understood how he could brake the way he does with this bike. But now, Pedrosa is faster (he was already mid-2012), Marquez is consistantly fast if not faster, so Jorge needs to push it and when he tries, he scares himslef to death because the bike becomes uncontrolable.

Too much weight on the rear, not enough on the front wheel (look at the Assen crash where he looses both wheels) how can you control a slide when the rear take over the control of the bike from the front? I drove both types of chassis and i wouldn't try to slide the one he has or ever try harder on the brakes entering a corner, it just doesn't work, the bike wont let you do that and would happily kill you if you try harder but it's damned fast at the apex for sure.

Now, this is the chassis he asked for and at the end of the day, without Rossi and Burgess, there is no guaranty they would have been able to even figure what their problem was, i have a hard time to recall Yamaha screwing the pouch with a chassis that bad in 40 years of following Moto GPs.

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pogo_it

Joined:

Jul 05

Posts: 119

pogo_it says:

ch987

Third in all time wcs, but if you take the doohan view that "only big bike championships count" (as he said when Rossi won his 5th world championship equalling doohans record) then he is indeed the winningest of all time. Where is stoner in that list? (especially your list of all capacity championships)

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DoubtingThomas

Joined:

Apr 13

Posts: 371

Chassis

They (Yamaha) kind of messed things up in 2011 too. Had to go back to the 2010 chassis if I recall. Not that they've messed things up, but they do seem to have only one real advantage over the Honda and that's high speed cornering. Hard braking has always been Rossi's forte, but not Jorge's, so not surprisingly they've lost that advantage over the years.

You did manage a whole post without using the S word.

An oft-used duplicitous tactic. Stoner (we are talking about him yeah?) is mentioned in the article, and also by yourself, by Bulto, and initially by serial Rossi hater, snivellingnev7.

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DeGrasse

Joined:

Aug 13

Posts: 2707

DeGrasse says:

@DoubtingThomas

 They have the longer swing arm since 2011, you are right there.

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