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Anonymous

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Matthew Birt  says:

Casey Stoner unlikely to take up HRC test role again

Double MotoGP world champion Casey Stoner is looking increasingly unlikely to continue as test and development rider for Honda in 2014. HRC had intended to keep the Australian developing its factory RC213V throughout 2014 after he made numerous testing appearances in Japan at the end of last season. Stoner, who retired from MotoGP at the end of 2012, is taking a complete...

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  • Posted 161 days ago (13 February 2014 12:35)

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saturn392

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Nov 03

Posts: 1967

saturn392 says:

Pacey

you know I love you and Rainmaker man but ..... Casey attracts controversy because he's Casey - beating Vale is separate issue.

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DeGrasse

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Aug 13

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DeGrasse says:

Wosi.

 I have this week MCN, haven't seen anything from Lawson (all please forgive my spelling of most riders names)... Which paper would it be?

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DeGrasse

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DeGrasse says:

My thought exactly...

 We were very fortunate to have been able to ride them. It was a unique experience, and something that can’t be repeated since today’s bikes have a lot of electronics. Back then it was all in the rider’s right wrist.”

AUGUST 04, 2012 Eddie Lawson

Precisely what makes the difference between guys who can slide a bike and those who can't.

 

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wosihound

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Jul 12

Posts: 2889

wosihound says:

Eddie..

Pages 22-25.

Last paragraph.

His thoughts on electronics.

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DeGrasse

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Aug 13

Posts: 2323

DeGrasse says:

#Got ya!

 Havent seen it looking at the last pages as i was... Cheers!

"We had two stroke power. Now if you can't ride a four stroke with the tyres and suspension they have these days... C'mon, do you really need traction control and wheelie control with that?"...

Too true, which make me say that most 4 stroke riders in front today wouldn't have made it to the front row on 500 cc vs guys like him, Gardner, Doohan Rainey and Schwantz.

I particularly like his picture on the 1000 Kawasaki with the rear wheel 45* out. :eyebrows:

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vtwinmark

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Aug 10

Posts: 288

vtwinmark says:

DeGrasse

 Nice to get all misty eyed about the greats of the 2 stroke era.....but  to say that most of the the current front runners would'nt be competitive against them is nonsense. The cream of every generation will rise to the top, and they get there by adapting best to the machinery that is available.

All of the current crop made their marks riding 2 strokes, so how can you base your assumption?

 

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Firebird3

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Nov 11

Posts: 776

Firebird3 says:

Agreed vtwin

You adapt and ride what is put infront of you. These guys have a talent to ride bikes fast, so you would see the same guys out there. Who would be slightly better than the other might change a bit, as certain people adapt better to certain bikes.                 With the 'who likes what rider' debate. I for one certainly don't have a problem with any riders and I only create a bit of banter to offset the likes of Nostro, who obviously has a serious problem with a certain rider. I think a few others are in the same boat as well.

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DeGrasse

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Posts: 2323

DeGrasse says:

vtwinmark

 Competitive vs the list of champs i quoted, which is a little different kind of nonsense... The "cream" didn't develop the necessary skills to ride a 500 100% and become champs on them when they were there, only a handful of very skilled and trained people made it, how do you expect this "cream" to do it now?

@Firebird3 I'd love to see Lorenzo adapt to Marquez style and be able to ride the M1 the way it could be ridden on the gas, simply because i support Yamaha regardless of who wins on them and that they need to be able to counter Marquez over the next few years.

Unfortunately, look at the partials of previous seasons, and ask yourself; wouldn't have a guy like Kosinski (or Cadalora, same style) fared as well on the M1 in the same circumstances since 2008?

They both won on 500 cc...

MCN compare Lorenzo to Lawson which i think is very flatering but forgetting one major difference between the two; Lawson was a dirt tracker and spend hundred of hours riding 200cc mini sideways around cones or doing moto-cross at the Roberts ranch.

As for adaptability of riders, i think you guys forgot that there have been scores of very decent riders in the 500 category who never made it even with factory rides for this very reason. 

Not everyone is one of them (champs in my list) and there is a constant there; Honda telemetry did show that Doohan was precise to the 100eme mm with the gas, which is way above average, and what the 2 stroke requiered to get the best of them while staying on top of them, as Lawson said; all in the rider's wrist, not everyone acquired skills.

Then, many people were training with Roberts, some became champs, some didn't, (and there have been a few 250 world champs like Lorenzo) so talking about "adaptability" is leveling things from the bottom, no less (which is what 4 strokes + electronics does btw).

Now, i think you would be better off looking at their (today's Moto GP riders) respective styles (partials will helps) and ask yourself the question, which one is good on the gas? without this emotional compromission in mind, meaning; I don't dislike Lorenzo, i just don't think he's got what it takes to counter Marquez on skills only.

Now, for Yamaha stake i hope he is better than i think he is (we will see this year), because the Honda riders are not going to wait for the Espargaró brothers to be on the factory M1...

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wosihound

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Jul 12

Posts: 2889

wosihound says:

Hayden speaks.

In the long run, I think definitely, I would much rather the fans watch bikes that smoke the tire and wheelie, and on corner entry hop, and wheels come off the ground. I think it would be much more exciting. For a rider like myself, obviously it would probably suit my style a little bit better than a guy that comes from a 250 background. I want it so the guy sitting on his couch watches the race and says, "Oh my god, there's no way I could ever do that."

Now, because of the electronics, the guy sitting on the couch looks at it and thinks, "Aw, y'know, I could do that with a little time."


http://superbikeplanet.com/2014/Feb/140214a.htm

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Nostrodamus

Joined:

Mar 09

Posts: 4965

Nostrodamus says:

Do you actually observe anything Backpaddock?

Just as VTwin Mark says the cream of any generation rises regardless of the machinery beneath them. Nobody in recent years (with the possible exception of dirt tracker Nicky Hayden -title lost more by wiped out Capirossi and choking Rossi, than won by Hayden) has won the premier title without sublime throttle control skills and being one of the best two riders of that particular year.

For such a self proclaimed expert who onced attended a track day on his Yamaha Thunderarse you do display a real ignorance of the riding skills on display.

These one litre things have 280HP, not the 140-180 of the Roberts / Lawson era. Which is not to belittle those riders (Lawson IS God), but up to double the power is far from insignificant. By all accounts 280hp needs the electronic assistance to maximise its delivery but regardless of this fact extreme talent is still required to control such power and find the traction required. If you think for a moment that any of the three Aliens doesn't have the incredibly subtle throttle control skills of the stars of the two stroke era then you're even more confused than I thought you were.

Lorenzo works that M1 damn hard, pushing the front and spinning the rear, but all done with such equisite throttle control and weight movement that it compresses into a style than appears on the surface as almost effortless. For that I admire the man. He has grown in stature as a rider year by year. 2013 he modified his technique to correct his corner exiting weakness and reaped the rewards of eight wins on the M1. I too thought he may have been relatively one dimensional with a 250 style not dissimilair to that of Rossi. But he's proven better than that, able to adapt to modern requirements. Adaption - the hallmark of any great rider. Lorenzo has never failed to perform in any of his GP years. But then he's also never had to ride a truly difficult machine - the little Derbi 125 notwithstanding.

Then at the other end of the riding technique spectrum we have Marquez. As Bulto astutely said if he is able to smooth away some of the rougher edges of his style (he's still a little too Bayliss like to my mind) gawd knows how quick he might end up.

2014 promises to be a cracker. All three Aliens on mature machines they know well. As with 2013 I don't know which way the chips will fall, although the pendulum of favouritism has swung away from Lorenzo / Pedrosa towards Marquez. Will the two older hands be able to take it to the WC? As for the second tier can any make the jump? Difficult to see any of them being more than what they have been for the past few season. Bit part players with occasional flashes. I for one still see 2014 as a three horse race.

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